Lew Rockwell interviews Jesse Trentadue about the apparent murder of his brother Kenneth Trentadue over the Oklahoma City bombing and the secret infiltration of patriot groups by the sinister PATCON:

“But then, in the course of my war with the FBI, I stumbled across reference in one of the documents they produced to an operation called PATCON, P-A-T-C-O-N. I found out that PATCON was an acronym for Patriot Conspiracy. And the FBI immediately began to back-peddle away from PATCON when I pressed them about what is PATCON. They came back and said, well, it was a small operation in Alabama designed to catch some folks who had stolen night-vision goggles from the military and were selling them. But it looked bigger than that. It looked much bigger than that. When I looked at the documents, I could see there were references to PATCON Group 1, PATCON Group 2, and a whole bunch of PATCON operations all over the United States. And I, over the years, kept pushing and pushing on PATCON, and more and more information started to come out.

But where the PATCON story really took off was last summer. I received a call from a man who told me, he said, I’ve been reading the information on the Internet about PATCON. He said, you have all the pieces, you just haven’t put them together. And I said, what do you mean. He said, you don’t see the big picture, and I’ll come up and – I’ll come out and see you and tell you about it, so he came to see me. He had been one of the major undercover operatives for the FBI in PATCON for about 10 years. PATCON ran throughout the ’90s.

His health was bad. He said that he wanted to, I guess, set the record straight about what had happened. He had joined the FBI in filtrating about 23 groups. And he said his objective was, he felt that these groups were dangerous and a threat to the country. But looking back on it, he now sees that the real objective of the FBI was to infiltrate and then fight these groups so they could be crushed. And he said they targeted the right wing, the military movement, evangelical Christian right, and others who were out of favor perhaps with the government or were critical of the government. He said that Ruby Ridge was a PATCON operation, Waco was a PATCON operation. He told me that he believed Oklahoma City was a PATCON operation but he couldn’t say for sure because he wasn’t involved in that operation. But he thought it was a PATCON operation because the others who had worked with him on PATCON were there.

And PATCON is an ugly, ugly story. According to this man, that PATCON was running guns and ammunition, automatic weapons out of the same gun store in Arizona that’s now the subject of the Fast and Furious scandal, and doing it in the ’90s. So when Attorney General Holder says the government new nothing about PATCON – about Fast and Furious, that this a rogue operation run by a local ATF agent in Arizona, that’s not true. The equivalent of PATCON, the prototype of PATCON was being run by the FBI and the ATF in the mid 1990s. Only there, they were funneling weapons and ammunition to the militia movement and the right, the extreme right of this country. And that’s the real story. And if folks would get beyond Fast and Furious and look where the real story is, it will be PATCON.

I’d like to talk a little bit more about Elohim City. It’s a fascinating place because of the people who were there. McVeigh was there. The Midwest Bank Robbers were there. Guthrie was there. Strassmeir was there. And as I started to probe the FBI for information related to Elohim City, I found out the ATF had informants there. The Secret Service was involved. And recently, I discovered that the CIA was involved. Now you have to ask yourself, what in the hell is the CIA doing involved with a right wing, evangelical Christian group in eastern Oklahoma. And when I pressed the CIA for documents and records linking Strassmeir, CIA, and Elohim City to the bombing, I received a denial from the CIA. And the reason they gave for not releasing anything to me was, and I quote, “Unauthorized release of this information could cause grave damage to our national security,” unquote. For the first time in all these years I’ve been fighting the government for information under the Freedom of Information Act that is the only time that national security has ever been used as a reason not to turn over documents. And it is a bullet-proof exemption. All they have to do is say “national security,” you can’t look beyond that statement. But I think it’s telling that they raised and played that national security card when I asked for information linking Strassmeir, the CIA, Elohim City, and the bombing. Immediately, they’re back with that national security claim.”